Hope at My Mother's Bedside

(0:00 - 0:07) Okay, all right. Hey, Becky. Hey, Laurel, so good to see you. (0:07 - 0:15) Great to see you. I just wanna start by saying, we talked about doing this a really long time ago. We have, we have. (0:16 - 0:35) One of the first persons I mentioned it to, I said, I would like to bring everybody on for them to share something about their story or experience of the end of life. And then I got the podcast started and I said, you know what? I've got to have, I've got to have Becky. Thank you for having me. (0:36 - 0:49) Carving out time and doing this and inviting some people. So anyway, well, welcome. So I'm just gonna do a small little introduction and then hand it over to you to do more introducing. (0:49 - 1:10) But I really just wanna capture it on the recording that you were one of the first people that ever reached out to me about training. And you were, you live in Alabama and you work with a hospice agency there. And you said, we want a Christian dual training program and I wanna learn about it. (1:11 - 1:37) And so it was very encouraging to me to know that there is interest and that I was on the right path. So I will never forget that. But why don't you share a little bit about yourself and your work to get us started? Okay, well, I am Becky Justin and like Laurel said, I live in Mobile, Alabama, married to my very best friend. (1:38 - 1:52) We celebrate 45 years this year. We have three sons, two beautiful daughter-in-laws, six grandchildren, and they're just scattered all over the world. And I've been a nurse for 43 years. (1:52 - 2:18) My background was more med surg to start pediatrics. And then I branched into ER, ICU, trauma. And then about 29 years ago, the Lord put it on my heart to go back to school and I became a licensed massage therapist and incorporated my nursing with that. (2:18 - 2:40) But my husband and I've been involved in inner healing ministry for about 40 years. And so I started incorporating some of that into my practice. Very quickly, the Lord shifted that and just started seeing a lot of spirit, soul, body connection with the work that I was doing. (2:42 - 3:03) And then about five years ago, the Lord opened the door just miraculously and I got called a phone call and asked if I would come on board here at our local hospice. It's called the Hospice Sad Retreat. It's called the Retreat at Sad Hospice in Mobile. (3:04 - 3:21) And they opened in 2019. They have a vision to just reach people in a more personal level, very compassionate, very empathetic. It truly is like a retreat when family members come. (3:22 - 3:35) Our company is a privately owned local company. And so we do a lot more than just hospice. We do palliative care, we do home health, we do education. (3:36 - 4:02) We just really reach out to the community in a lot, but it's an interdisciplinary. But kind of circling back to the hospice, we do in-home hospice and we also do inpatient, which is where I'm on the inpatient side. We've got 24 privately owned beds and the family members come, they can stay, they can go home, they know that their loved one's taken care of. (4:03 - 4:27) And when I came on board, I brought a lot of the inner healing and the massage that I do for the patients and the family members. That has since grown and I've become part of the bereavement team here. We have an amazing bereavement team that really reaches out to the family members before, during and after their loved one is passed. (4:27 - 4:34) So it's kind of all encompassing. So that's who kind of I am in a nutshell. That's amazing. (4:34 - 4:47) Let me ask you a little bit more about the healing ministry. And so when, you formed a nonprofit, is that right? We did. We did this past year or last year. (4:47 - 5:04) The Lord really put it on our hearts, my husband and I, a couple of years ago, that we needed to start a nonprofit and really branch out. And we kind of drug our feet a little bit just because he was a school teacher and worked full-time and retired last year. And finally the Lord said, do this. (5:05 - 5:21) So we both got ordained as ministers and then we got started the nonprofit and it's a 501c3. And so people are able to reach us through that. We're in the process of developing the website. (5:21 - 5:56) So if you ask me for the website, I don't have a link for that yet, but we are getting that up and running hopefully within the next month and a half or so. And your goal is to reach outside of Mobile into the world? What are your goals with your ministry? Well, we wanna just be able to reach one person at a time, marriages, families, couples, children, all age groups, all people groups. And we tease and say, have a suitcase, we'll travel. (5:56 - 6:17) And so, and I actually do that a lot with my role here at the hospice. I administer a lot outside of our entity and talk to people about what does it mean to be an end-of-life doula? Because as you and I both know, nobody likes to talk about death and dying. That's just not on our radar as human beings. (6:18 - 6:41) But it's such a part of who we are. And if we, as death and resurrection end-of-life doulas are able to educate the population that inner healing that Larry and I really strive for, it just kind of all comes together. And it helps people to understand that death and dying, you don't have to be afraid of that. (6:42 - 6:51) Right, right. Well, the only way we can avoid the fear is by knowing Jesus. And so your ministry is perfect. (6:52 - 7:24) That's really, really exciting. And God's giving you a lot of opportunities to be a part of people's lives. And not just that, but the deaths that we have daily in our lives, right? When our marriage is in trouble or we have another problem personally through work or in our home, it's usually a death and resurrection that we experience as God heals us, right? Our way of doing things has to end in His new way. (7:25 - 7:37) That's right, that's right. And I think that's why we, the name of our 501c3 is called Refiners Gold Ministry. And we realize that every person is created in the image of God. (7:38 - 8:04) And just through life, through wounds, traumas, lies, whatever that person is holding onto, that gold that's inside of them kind of gets buried. And so we're able to come on and through the leading of the Holy Spirit and help them realize that it's still there. That seed, that gold is still there and help them to mine it out, to pull it out. (8:04 - 8:58) And especially at the end of one's life, when you walk through seeing someone get to the end of their life and they're like so many regrets and a lot of unreconciliation, a lot of unforgiveness and being able as death and resurrection end of life doulas, that's a mouthful, but as we're able to come alongside them and help them realize the value of who they are, kind of like the thing on the cross, he was an 11th hour, but the value of who he was and is, was no less than the person that gave their life to the Lord at four years old. That's still the same. Absolutely, yeah. (8:58 - 9:08) Wow, wow. Well, I love what you're doing and I'm so honored that you were a part of this training program. So that is wonderful. (9:09 - 9:22) So we're gonna move into talking about your mom's story, which you said a little bit about through training. It's gonna be as much of a treat for me today as for everybody else to hear. And I know it's not an easy story. (9:23 - 9:41) I don't know all the details, but I know it's not an easy story, but I wanna give you some time to open up about the experience that you had, your family had, and your mom had. So let's, you ready? Let's go for it. I just realized I don't have any Kleenex. (9:42 - 10:02) So let me reach over here and grab some cause I am a crier. So, you know, there's a scripture, it's Psalm 116, 15 in the New Living Translation version. And it says, the Lord cares deep when his loved ones die. (10:03 - 10:21) He cares deep. And when you see someone like we did with our mom that suffered a tragedy that she didn't ask for, and then the three weeks that followed, it was hard. I mean, it was really hard. (10:22 - 10:29) We're a really big Hispanic family. So we tend to be a little bit Kleenex. She's got really strong personalities. (10:30 - 10:42) We've all grown up. My mom and dad grew us, raised us up with a Catholic faith. And so, so grateful for that, that they instilled that foundation in us. (10:43 - 11:11) Through the years, each of us have embraced their faith, you know, in their own unique way, which is beautiful to watch. So 2016, my mom and dad lived up in Michigan at a lake. And they just really felt like they wanted to sell their lake home and just have a single home back in Colorado, which was really their dream home up in Fair Play, Colorado. (11:11 - 11:32) And so I think they just got tired of managing two homes. So my son, our youngest son and I drove up and we helped my mom and dad get their house packed. My brother and his wife came and we got the U-Haul loaded. (11:34 - 11:50) And the day before that I was driving back, our youngest son was gonna stay there and help drive the Nana and Papa's U-Haul back to Colorado. That was his job. And so I had to get back to Mobile. (11:50 - 12:06) So the day before I left though, I was having my quiet time and my mom came in and she sat on my bed and I could just tell something was stirring in her. My mom was very, very strong in her faith. Always prayed her novena. (12:09 - 12:24) She just, she loved the Lord. And my husband and I were able to lead her to the Lord in a personal relationship many years prior. And she really embraced it. (12:24 - 12:33) I mean, she embraced, she was all in. Continued to go to Catholic Church and that was so important to them. And, but she and I were really close. (12:34 - 12:44) And so we got to pray a lot about a lot of deep things. So when she came in that morning, I could just tell something was kind of sitting on her heart. And so we walked through some things. (12:46 - 12:58) She still felt like she had some unforgiveness towards some of her siblings. She also came from a big Hispanic family. And so she and I talked about it. (12:58 - 13:06) We talked to the Lord about it. And she, she really forgave them. I mean, you could really tell. (13:07 - 13:24) So the day went on, we finished packing. The next day I get up and I go to say goodbye. And normally because my husband and I are the only ones of seven siblings that lived away, when we would go home to visit, saying goodbye was always really hard. (13:25 - 13:46) But we always would get in the car, even though tearful, we'd pull out of the driveway and honk our horn. But this time when I was with my mom up at the lake, I got in the car and I just felt a nudging in my spirit. Get out of the car and go give her another hug. (13:47 - 13:55) I'm so glad I'd listened. So I got out of the car and went and gave her a big hug. Just told her that I loved her again. (13:56 - 14:14) Got back in the car and then drove back to Mobile. And then that weekend she was staying up in Michigan because one of my cousins was getting married. And so we got a phone call early one morning, my sisters and I were out in Las Vegas for a nursing conference. (14:15 - 14:40) And we got a phone call from our youngest son and said, mom, Nana's fallen downstairs and the ambulance is here. And so what had happened without going into a lot of detail, but we have no idea why. She was at her sister's home, had been downstairs ironing, had come back up and for whatever reason went back down into the basement. (14:41 - 14:54) And when she did, she tripped. And when she fell, she ended up fracturing her C1, C2, which is really, really bad. And so our son is a lifeguard trained. (14:55 - 15:31) And so he knew immediately they heard her fall, went down, immediately started CPR because she had stopped breathing, called the ambulance, got her to the hospital. And so she is of course fully cognizant of what's going on, but now she's on a ventilator and she's paralyzed from the neck down. And if you know my mom, she was an amazing, just private person, but to know that this is now her life, to be fully mentally aware, not being able to speak. (15:32 - 15:41) And now she's dependent on a ventilator. So of course, all of the siblings come, we're all there. Decisions are being made. (15:41 - 16:03) What's this gonna look like? We went through two weeks there at the hospital at ICU and she wanted to go home. She wanted to go back to Colorado. So the decision was made to hire a private medical airline to fly her back to Colorado. (16:04 - 16:23) And my sister and one of my other sisters who was also a nurse, she and I flew with my mom. And we found a facility in Colorado that was capable of taking. And now we're thinking long-term because people can live a long time on ventilators. (16:23 - 16:44) And my mom and dad were incredibly strong people, healthy, spiritually, mentally healthy, everything. And so when we looked for a facility, we had to find some place that could handle a ventilator dependent person that could live for years. And there's no way my dad could have handled that at home. (16:45 - 17:07) I mean, we talked about it because half of our family, my siblings were either medically career or we're on the computer side. And so they would have gotten plenty of care had we chosen to do that, but dad just felt like it'd be best. So we found an amazing facility, took the flight, got her to Colorado and got her settled there. (17:07 - 17:36) But let me back up the story. So why I mentioned about her coming in that morning during my quiet time. So the Lord showed me later on that because she struggled so much with a lot of challenges with her own siblings, and she was so strong in her faith, the Lord showed me that he brought her back to the place where there was brokenness and unforgiveness. (17:36 - 17:54) And he allowed her to have that time with her siblings, even though she was on a ventilator and couldn't speak to them, she could mouth words. We learned to lip read really fast. And so they were able to have that two weeks with her in and out. (17:55 - 18:25) And the night before we left with her, the whole family gathered around her bed and we prayed, and the priest came and anointed her. And she was able to look every one of her siblings in the eye and say, I love you, which was really huge when you look back and say, gosh, what a horrible tragedy. But the Lord used that to bring reconciliation to her and to her family. (18:26 - 18:53) So fast forward, we're now back in Colorado and trying to adjust to what is this gonna look like now. And I, being the only sibling that lived away, thank God for my husband, he's just an amazing saint, just released me and said, you do what you need to do. So I stayed out there, which allowed most of my siblings to be able to continue to do their work that they needed to do. (18:54 - 19:09) And I just took time off from my job in Mobile. And during that time, mom and I had a lot of conversations about what is the days ahead look like. And by this time, her body was starting to break down a little bit. (19:09 - 19:28) She's starting to get a little bit bed sores, even though we turned her as much as possible. And so Friday, the priest came in and was talking to her. My dad had gone back up to their mountain home to kind of get some things and tend to some business up there. (19:29 - 20:00) And when the priest came in, I asked my mom, do you want me just to step out? And she said, no, I want you to stay in here. And so she and the priest talked and she asked him, is it a sin if I choose to turn the ventilator off? Which is a really hard question. And the priest just so lovingly looked at her and he said, Aurora, that was her name, Aurora, A-U-R-O-R-A. (20:02 - 20:16) He said, it is not a sin for you to turn this ventilator off. The extenuating circumstances of your life, that the Lord knows that. And so he talked with her, told her different stories. (20:18 - 20:31) And I could just tell on her face that she was still troubled about something. And so I asked her, I was like, mom, do you want me to step out? And she said, no. I said, do you wanna ask the priest something? And she said, yes. (20:32 - 20:53) And I asked her, what do you wanna ask him? And she said, I'm afraid to die. And so immediately the priest just stepped right in and just began to tell her the verses in the scripture and just pray over her. I mean, he really stepped up. (20:53 - 21:03) And thankfully I grabbed my phone and was able to record that. And so mom was like, okay, it's not a sin. I'm getting ready to step into heaven. (21:03 - 21:11) And you just tell me, I'm watching our time. And so she was ready. She was ready. (21:11 - 21:17) And I was like, hang on a second, mom. You can't just turn the ventilator off. Dad's not here. (21:17 - 21:25) Your children aren't here. People need to be able to sign off documents. So we gotta wait until all of that's in place. (21:25 - 21:39) So she talked to the priest and he told her, Aurora, I will come back down. Give your family time with you. Sunday after mass, I'll come back down and then we'll turn the ventilator off and I will be here with your family. (21:39 - 21:51) So that was the plan. Of course then my dad comes back and we began telling him what she had decided. And it was hard because she had an advanced directive, which is really important. (21:53 - 22:08) And so she already had that in place and it was already documented what she wanted and she did not wanna live the rest of her life this way. And so Saturday, everybody came in and out. We each had our time with her. (22:09 - 22:20) And then Sunday morning, God is so merciful. Her heart just stopped. So we didn't have to turn the ventilator off. (22:21 - 22:46) And that was the hardest thing for us as a family, but it was such a huge blessing that the Lord gave us because then my dad didn't have to live the rest of his life that he was alive. He actually passed three years later, tragically. But we didn't have to live questioning, did we make the wrong decision? Even though she had an advanced directive, my dad could have stepped in and said, no, no, no, we're not doing this. (22:47 - 23:05) But I'm just so grateful, so grateful. So we journeyed since 2016 without our beautiful daughter. We have a mom, but it's wonderful because there's a difference, Laura, you and I had mentioned in our emails. (23:06 - 23:27) When somebody grieves and mourns and laments, the scripture is very clear about that. And I'm so grateful that we have our faith and that we've been able to walk with the Lord, with the Holy Spirit. On days when it's like, you know what? I really miss my mom. (23:27 - 24:05) I really miss my dad, but we're able to process that. And here at hospice, when we're working one-on-one, I always try to encourage the family members and not just here at hospice and our inpatient facility, but anybody that I talk to about death and dying. And I always encourage them and say, you know what? If I can leave one thing with you is never grieve without the Holy Spirit, because when we grieve without the Holy Spirit, we grieve and it carries us and keeps us in a place of darkness with no hope. (24:05 - 24:44) But when we have hope, knowing that death has happened, but there's resurrection, there's new life, there's a new heaven coming and a new bodies, and we're all gonna be together again. The Holy Spirit allows us to grieve with hope, and that keeps us going. And like Jesus, if we stop in the verse, my husband's my GPS with verses I should have wrote it down, but Jesus said, I think it's in Hebrews, oh, but for the joy set before him, he endured the cross. (24:45 - 25:11) How can Jesus in the natural state as a man, he was the son of God, but he had to train his spirit, his natural man, his soul, his physical body to embrace joy in the midst of suffering. How did he do that? Because of the Holy Spirit. He lived with the Holy Spirit day in and day out. (25:12 - 25:31) That's what allowed him to be able to say that, oh, but for the joy set before him, he endured the cross. And the reward was you, Laurel, it was me, it was our family, it was our children, it was my sweet mama. Well, let's pause for a minute. (25:31 - 25:42) I wanna say that you told your mom's story and your story and your family's story so beautifully. I know you said, I haven't done this before. But it seems like you have. (25:43 - 26:07) You did a beautiful job. And I know that it is gonna make a difference in the people's lives who see this because you've just brought it all together. You've talked about the importance of considering how you are willing or not willing to live with the end of your life and your dad's role, but that God's grace and mercy provided a different way. (26:08 - 26:25) I know of another family that a similar thing happened. The husband was going to turn the ventilator off and the next day it was all planned and she died in the night. And he said exactly the same thing. (26:27 - 26:38) I was at peace with it, but this was so much better. And it did, it changed his grieving for sure. It kind of sets us free. (26:38 - 26:43) I set him free, set your family free. Wow, well, thank you. Thank you. (26:44 - 26:57) And I, so I mean, amazing timing. It's 1.30. So if you're okay with it, I'm gonna, so everybody, they can turn their cameras. I may have to help you because if I muted you or turned your camera off, you might be stuck. (26:58 - 27:13) So, but the second part of the conversation, the Cafe Podcast gives everybody the chance to come and ask you questions and share their own experience. So we open it up to the community. So thank you everybody. (27:14 - 27:32) And I'm gonna look at the chat and make sure there's nobody here that can't come back on with their camera. Let's see. All right. (27:32 - 27:56) Does anybody, anything Becky talked about today resonate with personal experience in your family or with a friend? Does anybody wanna share or ask Becky anything or maybe ask her about her massage work? The sky's the limit. I really appreciate it. And I was touched by everything you said, Rebecca. (27:56 - 28:16) Thank you for sharing that. And I wondered, like, how did you marry the aspect of End of Life Doula and your healing prayer ministry? How did that, maybe in a nutshell, how God moved in that way? Were you, because prayer is a huge heart thing for me as well. And I just kind of wondered how those two came together. (28:17 - 28:42) That's a great question, Malia. So when we started our inner healing ministry, we were part of the Healing Rooms of Mobile, which is part of John G. Lake's ministry in Spokane, Washington. And when we would pray with people, we just noticed that we would get a lot of repeaters that we just, they weren't receiving their healing. (28:43 - 29:00) So we went after, Lord, why, what are we missing? And so we found a ministry called Sozo, S-O-Z-O. And it's the Greek word in the New Testament for salvation, healing, and deliverance. Every time you see the word healing, that's that word Sozo. (29:01 - 29:36) So we got trained and started ministering through Sozo, which is inner healing, and it's all Holy Spirit led. And so we just, we ask questions, Holy Spirit shows up, and the person just is able to, we call it, if somebody's been going to a counselor for 20 years, it just gets in there. And what would take 10 years of counseling can do in a session because you're going after the lie of what that person believed. (29:36 - 30:02) And we're reconnecting that person with the Godhead, with Father, Jesus, and Holy Spirit. And so, because we were trained in that and doing inner healing ministry, it was just a smooth transition. And I had always prayed with people in my massage practice, I didn't always pray out loud, but the Lord sometimes would, I was always praying in my spirit over them. (30:03 - 30:24) And because you're connecting somebody's spirit to spirit. And for those of you that have had body work done, and you've gone to somebody that you walked out and you went, that just was not what I needed because they're carrying things in their spirit. And when we have physical contact with each other, it makes a difference. (30:24 - 30:50) And so we always wanna carry the light of Christ in us. And when we physically touch somebody, when we look somebody in the eye, when we speak to them, or we just pass them in the hallway, we're connecting with people spirit to spirit. And so, because we were trained in that, when I came here to the hospice, our bereavement director, Chelsea Gibson, amazing young lady. (30:51 - 30:59) And she came on actually as an end of life doula. And so, totally foreign to me. I was like, what's a doula? An end of life doula. (30:59 - 31:13) And so I was able to get educated. And I was like, okay, I definitely wanna be able to incorporate that in the inner healing, death and dying, as well as with my massage practice. And it's just all kind of flowed. (31:13 - 31:27) God's just knit it all together. Find that people are open then at the end of their life to more of a, like your mom at that time too, she was, she must, there were some things maybe she sensed. I don't know, or God just gave her a window. (31:27 - 31:43) But do you, when you actually are actively dying, do you feel people are more willing to look at some of that woundedness? Or do you feel like they kind of wall it off a bit? I think it's both. I'll tell you a quick story. We had a gentleman here, was an inpatient, was here for many, many weeks. (31:43 - 31:53) Kept the room dark. It was cold in there, did not wanna talk about God. And every time the staff would go in, we were pleasant, polite. (31:54 - 32:07) He would converse with us, but don't bring up God. And so every time I would walk in the room, I would simply ask him, we'll just call his name Joe. How are you doing today, Joe? We'd have a conversation. (32:08 - 32:19) I would put my hand on him with his permission and just gently touch his hand. But I never brought up God. But I'm constantly bringing in the spirit of God into that room. (32:19 - 32:30) And I'm praying in that room, Lord, open his eyes, open his heart. This man's getting ready to draw his last breath and he does not know you. Fast forward several, several, several weeks. (32:31 - 32:43) And it was very close. And I went into the room and I knew, this man's getting ready to draw his last breath and he doesn't know you. And so I just sat there and I just kept my hand on his hand. (32:44 - 32:55) And I just began to just hum in my spirit because he loved music. And I just felt the prompting and I just leaned over. And I said, Joe, I know you can hear me. (32:55 - 33:21) And I know you probably are looking at drawing your last breath. Do you want to know beyond a shadow of a doubt, the peace and the love that you have been looking for all your life and you haven't found it? I said, if that's something that you want, squeeze my hand. And he squeezed my hand. (33:24 - 33:37) And in that moment, you could see on his face, the peace of the Lord just settled over him. I didn't mention one word about Jesus. I didn't say you have to be baptized in water immersion. (33:37 - 33:47) None of that. Just the peace and the love settled over him of the Father. And he was able to draw his last breath differently. (33:48 - 33:53) He knew, he just knew. You could see it on his face. Same with my mom. (33:53 - 34:15) I knew the minute that she stepped into heaven before her physical body stepped into heaven. When she prayed that prayer with the priest, I watched my mama's spirit leave and go. And even though we were having time with her, that Saturday before her physical body stopped, her physical body had to catch up to where her spirit already was. (34:16 - 34:23) Thank you. You're welcome. I'm glad you told that story about Joe. (34:23 - 34:43) That's really, really amazing. Because you prayed, you prayed for him for weeks and the Lord answered that prayer. There's so much we can do for people without imposing what they're afraid is gonna make them uncomfortable. (34:46 - 34:57) Allegra, I see you're ready. Yeah, I just, I had something I thought to share. And then just as you told that story, I just got a little teary too, because I didn't remember. (34:59 - 35:19) So I'm gonna try not to take up too much time. But first, we had a similar, sort of similar experience with my dad, where his last year plus of life was just horrible dementia. And so I've always seen, he ended up getting pneumonia and a UTI and died like within three days. (35:19 - 35:45) But we were in this thing where we're like, he could go, the doctors were like, he could live for 10 plus more years in this wretched, just awful state. And so he ended up getting pneumonia and UTI and like within three days, everything shut down and he actually died quite peacefully, which we were expecting 10 horrid years plus an awful dramatic death. And so I always saw God in that, but I was not actually a Christian at that time when he died. (35:46 - 35:57) And I don't even know if he was saved or baptized. I know my parents didn't raise me religious. And so I always like to imagine that God found him in the end there. (35:59 - 36:29) But I just remembered that he, by the time we were all in the hospital with him, they were explaining he can hear, but he wasn't talking anymore. And we were mostly quiet, but they're like, you can play music. And I remember the family debate, what music do we play? And he had always loved, loved, loved, loved the opera Parsifal about the Parsifal searching for the Holy Grail, and which is not strictly Christian, but drew on some Christian elements. (36:29 - 36:44) And so we played a piece from that for him and I had completely forgotten that we did that. And so that's another piece where I like to hope that that brought him either back to God or I don't even know. I don't even know if he was saved or not. (36:45 - 36:51) But anyway, so I thought that related and it was worth sharing. That's so good, Allegra. That really is. (36:52 - 37:08) And I'm glad you said that about the hearing because I think that's one thing that people don't realize that, you know, they're so distraught because I want to have one last conversation with mama. I want her to wake up and talk to me. And a lot of times they don't. (37:08 - 37:21) And we always say to our family members, talk to them. They can hear the conversation going on in the room around them. I don't know how they've discovered it's a scientifically proven fact. (37:22 - 37:40) I've been a nurse for, like I said, 43 years. I don't know how they discovered this, but our hearing is our last sense to leave our physical bodies and our hearing is the first sense to come back. So kind of picture yourself, this is how I describe it to our family members. (37:40 - 38:02) Like you're asleep, you're not quite ready to open up your eyes yet, but you start hearing things around you and then you open your eyes. That's where mama or daddy is, or your loved one is. They're in that thin veil place where their physical bodies are still here and they're hearing, they're listening, they're listening. (38:02 - 38:19) They may not be able to verbally respond, but they're listening. So talking to them is really important at the end of life as well. I think that God, I mean, that's a salvific opportunity. (38:19 - 38:54) People may not be believers and they're beyond any more verbal or physical expression, but they can still hear the gospel. I love how the gospel doesn't even have to be framed in those words that he might've not been able to receive because of whatever happened in his past that hardened his heart, but that you saw it happen where he saw God, like he experienced that. And I just love that God doesn't need specific words. (38:55 - 39:12) He comes in the ways that people can receive him and I love that. Yeah. This was a really good conversation to follow up what we talked about from 12 to one for those training in module one. (39:12 - 39:36) We met and we did, we talked about how this death and resurrection doula ministry being doulas for an individual and their families at the end of life is not just a practical ministry. I'm here as a servant of Christ to be the hands and feet of Jesus, but it's a healing ministry. It is. (39:36 - 40:15) And we're gonna see that healing manifested in so many different ways. And that, I think so often what it's like hard for us to conceptualize, because we have in our minds that healing has got to be something, just like that we can see and that we can touch and the exact opposite of what is going on here. But in your mom's story, God knew what needed to happen at the end of her life, right? For her and for the others that there needed to be reconciliation and he provided for it in a way that we don't like, right? We don't want that to be the way he provides for that. (40:15 - 40:45) We don't want it to be being bound to the bed and on a ventilator. We have this idea that, oh, it's gotta be like this way or that way, but just being, just allowing God to do his grace is going to provide healing measures that we don't know. They're way deeper than we could ever ask him to take us. (40:46 - 40:52) And oftentimes it looks like the opposite. Yeah, it really does, Laurel. You are exactly right. (40:53 - 41:04) I sat with a young lady. She's beautiful soul, strong believer. Her and her husband just full on ministry. (41:05 - 41:30) And she was diagnosed with breast cancer in advanced stages and was pregnant. And she had two other children already. And she chose not to do chemotherapy or radiation or surgery because she wanted to save the life of her daughter. (41:31 - 41:47) And so I came on board and began to just spend more time with her one-on-one as the cancer advanced. And then the last several weeks of her life spent with her in the hospital. And I can remember one conversation. (41:48 - 42:06) She was really struggling because she, I mean, here she is this young, vibrant, beautiful believer, so in love with people. Loved being a mom, I loved being a wife. And it was like, this is not how I planned my life. (42:07 - 42:41) And so she was struggling, what's gonna happen to my children? They were little and how are they gonna navigate through life? And so one of the conversations I had with her towards the end of her days, she and I, it was late at night. And she said, Becky, I don't understand. How can God leave my children without a mother? And so we began to talk about that and pray through some things and the fears that she was struggling with. (42:41 - 43:00) We were addressing the fears head on. And all of a sudden she sat back and she looked at me and she goes, oh my goodness, the light bulb moment came on. And she said, I don't have to fear for my children because they're gonna have the best mother in the whole world. (43:01 - 43:22) They're gonna have the mother heart of God, which is the Holy Spirit. And he is gonna help them, teach them, instruct them, comfort them because it says in Matthew, blessed are those who mourn, they will be comforted. Who is called the comforter? The Holy Spirit. (43:23 - 43:40) And she became so joyful in realizing that here she is at the end of her life, but her children were gonna be okay because the Holy Spirit let her know, I'm not leaving your kids. I'm gonna be right here with them. And they are amazing, amazing kids. (43:40 - 43:57) They're growing up to be, this is about five, six years ago. And husband is still being a single dad, raising those children and they are just all in. And Larry and I come alongside them and just help them and pray with them and minister to them. (43:57 - 44:02) But yeah, it doesn't look like what we want it to look like. No. Wow. (44:04 - 44:09) Wow, you've got amazing stories. You've seen a lot. This is really, really helpful. (44:11 - 44:46) Yeah, one of the things I learned when I trained to be a doula in another program was some of the toughest end of life experiences can be a young person, particularly mom or dad and an aggressive cancer. And because there's just not a lot of time to process what's happening. But I think if there's any possibility that we can process, it's gonna be through the word of God, through the promises of God. (44:47 - 45:28) And I've said, I have my first full client as a doula was what fell into that category, relatively young mom, not as young as I think that woman, but that was her biggest fear too is like, how is my daughter going to grow up all right without me? And that just, oh, that just plagued her. And the same outcome is that the Holy Spirit put a peace in her heart, that if he thought that the mother needed to be there, he would have allowed it. And he had other plans. (45:28 - 46:03) He had other ways that he was gonna show his grace in that little girl's life. And yeah, I can't imagine you could eradicate all fear and just the heartbreak of wanting to be there for those years. But the word also promises us that when God returns and he restores or when he brings a new heaven to earth and our bodies are raised and we live in new bodies, that this pain and suffering, we're not gonna have tears anymore. (46:03 - 46:24) So we're not going to lament and regret. It's going to be worth it. I mean, I don't know if that's the right way to say it, but it's going to be like our pain and suffering now has meaning in eternity and it will be reconciled. (46:25 - 46:32) And I don't think we cannot understand that here. We can hope for it, but I don't think we can fully understand it. Yeah. (46:33 - 46:46) Yeah. I think that's too Laurel. I think that's why we're so grateful for you and your program, just bringing just that truth that it's death and resurrection. (46:47 - 47:00) We can't do what we do without it. So thank you so much for, I just remember that first phone call you and I had and it was just like, it was a divine phone call. It really was. (47:01 - 47:35) And I'm grateful for this, where I work here, just the opportunity to stay in and day out. It's just, there's something about being able to, I came in on the tail end of your training. I mean, I think it was Jenna actually that mentioned it in the conversation that she had with that person that as doulas, you're going to have a lot of tough conversations with people and I think that if we can approach it with, I got to change their perspective. (47:35 - 47:54) I need to have an expectation or have a list of things. If you just go with the leading of the Holy Spirit, he's going to show you what to say, what not to say, to show you. I just actually prayed with someone this past, a couple of days ago. (47:54 - 48:01) She's looking for her to advance directive. She cannot find it. Her husband passed away many years ago. (48:01 - 48:12) And so she was talking to me about what the end of her life looks like. And so I'm like, we'll just call her name Sally. And I said, Sally, you need to have an advanced directive. (48:12 - 48:21) You need to have a durable power of attorney, a medical power of attorney, et cetera. This is the list of things. Do you have that? And she said, I do, but I can't find it. (48:21 - 48:30) And so I said, you know what, let's just pray. Let's just pray that God will help you to find them. She texted me back the next day. (48:30 - 48:50) So that was on Friday or Thursday. She texted me Friday morning and said, I don't know why, but I got up out of bed and I felt like the Lord told me, look under your bed. And so under her bed, she had a box full of legal papers that her and her husband had. (48:51 - 49:00) And she had forgot, she stuck it under there. And so here's the papers that she was needing. He cares, it matters. (49:00 - 49:07) God, he does. He cares about every detail. If advanced directives are, they are, they're important. (49:08 - 49:23) If they're important in this world, this is his world. And he's an organized kind of God, right? He organizes the trauma and the pain of our life. He does, he heals us and he makes things right. (49:24 - 49:38) And we experience it for real in areas of our life. We may not have every area of our life feeling that way all the time, but we can attest to his great work. And so he does, he cares about these details. (49:39 - 49:44) And if we bring our worries to him, he will work them out. That's right. Yeah. (49:45 - 49:59) Yeah, and it's an interesting thing, listening today. And it's this walking out with the grief, the deep grief of leaving that they are feeling and we are feeling with them. And also this element of God has ordained our days. (49:59 - 50:18) So there is not tragedy per se in this, in the sense that if God has ordained all of our days, then this is all he's ordained. And how to hold those things next to each other and walk ourselves and others through that. It's a tough one, finding that balance. (50:18 - 50:29) But like you said, the Holy Spirit. And it's true, Malia, because look at the tragedy that's happened in Texas. Those were little children. (50:30 - 50:50) Such a tragedy, you know, and yet their days were numbered. Yes. You know, it really seems like, you know, one of the things God's bringing out of this tragedy is the faith of these families is on display. (50:51 - 51:21) And in a time where, you know, we could probably argue, you know, in America, right, faith is maybe under attack or people are saying, you know, or polls report that our, you know, church attendance has declined so much. But the strength found in the Christian faith is I see it on display. And in a really large way through this tragedy. (51:22 - 51:41) And so thanks be to God who can bring something meaningful and purposeful and life-changing out of it. We have a few more minutes. So I don't wanna make, unless Becky has more to say, but I thought maybe I'll stop the recording and then we could do some introductions. (51:41 - 51:50) Cause I know there's a lot of new people today that came because they were really interested in hearing Becky's story. So Becky, thank you. You're welcome. (51:50 - 51:52) Thank you. Thank you.